#208158 - 11/15/09 01:54 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Tom Ecclestone
Member
Registered: 11/10/09
Posts: 3
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Thank you, Mark. The thread you pointed to was very infomative, and helpful. I will certainly look up the chapters you recommended. What you say makes a great deal of sence to me.
I was particularly interested where you said "The spectator is king. You have to know how to handle him. And the best way to handle him is to get inside his mind. You MUST learn to see things from the layman's point of view. Difficult, but essential to get the knack of this.
A well known mentalist once told me that it was impossible to think like a layman. I don't think it is impossible, just difficult...
Above all it will enable you to figure out how to manipulate the audience. Any fool can manipulate cards, coins etc; the real skill in close up magic is learning how to manipulate the people.".
Since it seems to go a long way towards answering my third question.
Thank you for your help.
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#208171 - 11/15/09 06:27 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Tom Ecclestone]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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The third question I could go on an on about but I shall try not to. I remember arguing with a pair of famous magicians about 30 years ago at a convention concerning the matter. They were talking the biggest load of tosh about it.I will not tell you who they are since they are both alive and one of them looks in here regularly.
You can get a great reaction from a 15 second trick. Just yesterday I was doing some magic for a restaurant owner and his family. No, I wasn't working at the restaurant. I was doing it for free as I often do. I did a couple of tricks and was my usual brilliant self. However the hit of the show was when I pulled some cards behind a child's ear. It took less than 10 seconds if even that. The whole family erupted with delight.
I will sometimes do the Vernon French Drop colour change. Again 10 seconds or so and again a great reaction. When I sell svengali decks I will sometimes do the old thing where you put a flea in the bag by flicking the side of the bag with your finger.
Again a great reaction. I will sometimes pretend to give someone their change and it vanishes. Matter of seconds and a great reaction. I have already mentioned above that I will do the business card thing. Great reaction but it is over in matter of seconds.
However a small trick like this should know it's place. You must never over present it as some idiot magicians do. I once saw some twit years ago make the head of a match fall off. Instead of doing it in a matter of seconds he gave a bloody history lesson about the execution of Mary Queen of Scots.
I told the two idiot celebrity magicians about this and they seemed to approve of this fool. They tried to lecture me about how you can make an insignificant trick into a miracle by proper showmanship.
These two twits are known particularly for their long winded magic. Too much talk and not enough action. I replied that I did not require lectures about showmanship since I was MARK LEWIS and they weren't. They were a trifle startled at this since nobody had ever heard of me yet were bowing and scraping before them when instead they should have been bowing and scraping before me since I knew what I was doing and they didn't. I suspect they still don't.
If it is a 15 second trick do it as a 15 second trick and don't try to make it into something it isn't. You will get a better reaction by underplaying it as you will by overplaying under the delusion you are using showmanship to build it up. DON'T BUILD IT UP! Get the bloody thing over and done with and you will get a great reaction. When you see Bill Malone pull a bunch of cards out of his mouth you don't hear him giving a long lecture about
how he had too many cards for dinner and felt like throwing up because of it. No. He just takes the cards of his mouth. The effect speaks for itself.
Let a 15 second trick remain a 15 second trick. YOu are not selling the trick anyway. You are selling YOURSELF!
Edited by Mark.Lewis (11/15/09 06:29 PM)
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#208190 - 11/16/09 09:23 AM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Glenn Bishop
Registered: 03/14/08
Posts: 417
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Standing Ovation Mark!!!!
Thank You!!!!
_________________________
Bish The Magish
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#208191 - 11/16/09 09:41 AM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Glenn Bishop]
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opie
Registered: 03/14/08
Posts: 456
Loc: austin tx
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Hooo Raaaahhhh, Mark.....opie
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#208199 - 11/16/09 11:03 AM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: opie]
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Tom Ecclestone
Member
Registered: 11/10/09
Posts: 3
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Thank you very much Mark, you really have been very helpful.
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#208225 - 11/16/09 03:32 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Tom Ecclestone]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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Naturally.
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#208284 - 11/17/09 06:57 AM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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Now does anybody else have any questions?
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#208302 - 11/17/09 12:20 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Pete McCabe
Registered: 01/18/08
Posts: 1368
Loc: Woodland Hills
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Yes. I'm sure your methods for dealing with difficult spectators work well for you and your audiences. But is there anything you do in advance to prevent spectators from becoming difficult?
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#208310 - 11/17/09 01:34 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Richard Kaufman]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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Not at all Richard. Not at all. Actually the opposite. I shall explain momentarily. I will agree however that when I am selling svengali decks I am like the devil incarnate and they are indeed often too frightened to interrupt.
This is not the approach I use with other types of performance. I shall explain in the next post. I shall be back soon.
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#208320 - 11/17/09 02:21 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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Now to answer Pete Mc'Cabe. There are indeed methods to discourage heckling before it starts. I have actually explained them already. I am not sure if I have the energy to cut and paste what I already said but one moment please.
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#208322 - 11/17/09 02:26 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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Please reread this. I posted it earlier on the thread.
.................................................................
Probably the best protection against the heckler is your own competence. After all, if you do your stuff well there is less opportunity for interruption. If you perform fluently and as if you know what you are doing it will tend to dissuade the pest from tormenting you. Everyone likes to watch a master at work, even the heckler. If you are exciting and entertaining this will often be enough to quell mutinous spectators. On the other hand, if you are ill at ease and awkward, not only will you cause the audience to experience the same feelings, you will be inviting trouble, as sure as the sun rises in the east. Your attitude is all-important; if you are humble you will tend to make people like you, and the more people like you the less heckling you will experience. Conversely, if you are arrogant and superior when you work, you will attract confrontation like a magnet, and well you will deserve it. Contrary to what you might expect, a little heckling is good for you. It keeps you alert, on your toes and teaches you not to be too complacent. It will encourage you to practice; when the loudmouth says, “I saw you switch that card!” he’s actually doing you a favour. Maybe you’ll practice so hard that next time he won’t see you switch it.
.................................................................
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#208324 - 11/17/09 02:42 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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And read this again also:
..................................................................
The esssence of the idea is that every human being on the planet has a
subconscious and some cases conscious resentment at being fooled by a
magician. No matter how wonderful the performer there is that underlying
resentment that is always there.
I will admit that the feeling does not always manifest itself in certain
appreciative spectators but it is there nevertheless, albeit on a
subconscious level.
I believe there are 4 types of spectators. Actually 5 if you count magicians
but I do not consider them to be normal human beings.
The first type of viewer is the best. This is someone who laughs and enjoys
the trick and the performance. The defensive resentment is still there
although it has been muted. I believe the process that goes on in the
spectator's mind is that he or she gives up before he starts. His or her ego
is not affected by the performance because he or she surrenders straight
away. By not getting involved in a contest of wits the ego is placated. The
spectator cannot be defeated because he has not entered the contest. He or
she then has an excuse to enjoy the performance. The "defensive resentment"
factor is still there but it has been shoved under the rug.
Then we have the people who "want to know how the engine works". Their ego
will want to find out how the trick is done. They will not try to wreck the
performance but they may not react as well as you want. That subconcious
resentment at being fooled is ever present.
Next we have the rare person who will show no reaction of any kind at all.
He may be enjoying what you do but his ego will not allow him to show you
that he enjoys it. He does not want to admit that he has been fooled.
Then of course we have the heckler. The defensive resentment at being fooled
is rather obvious here.
All these groups consist of human beings with feelings and emotions. Each
one of them has this defensive feeling although some manifest it more openly
than others. It behooves the smart magician to find some way of assuaging
this feeling in any way he can. If he is able to do this then a Shangri La
of positive audience reaction awaits him. If on the other hand he charges
ahead like a bulldozer inflicting his magic in a full steam ahead style
without considering this important facet of audience psychology he may find
that the reaction he gets from his magic is muted.
I am referring strictly to close up magic here and impromptu magic in
particular. Stage work and even formal close up may have different rules
although I expect that some of what I say may even apply here.
I liken this process to "taking their guns away" I had better explain.
If you approach a table in a restaurant (say) and try to entertain them you
will be confronted by this phenomena to a greater or lesser degree. Very
often the spectators will have their guns loaded, so to speak, with this
"defensive resentment" I have seen some magicians foolishly try to outshoot
the audience by performing aggressively or in other ways trying to get
reaction and it doesn't come off as it should.
Instead I believe you should TAKE THEIR GUNS AWAY before you start! Remove
that "defensive resentment" before you even start and continue to remove it
as you continue.
How you do this is up to you. I can tell you how I do it but of course you
are not me. No doubt you are very relieved by this.
This is how I do it. I am not suggesting you do it this way. I am only
telling you for purposes of illustrating what I am trying to get at.
I act absent minded, eccentric, slightly incompetent and even stumble over
words. Not when I am selling svengalis or performing at a trade show. This
is a different medium and different rules apply. I am referring to
performing impromptu close up magic.
Sometimes I will forget what cards I force on people, sometimes I drop
cards, sometimes I make mistakes. In fact, I don't think I have ever
performed on a single occasion in my entire life when something hasn't gone
wrong.
Yet this is how I get the strong reaction I do.
It seems that I am not in control but I know exactly what I am doing.
By being so disarming I remove all audience resentment. Or as much as I can
anyway. It is actually impossible to remove it completely. However it
behooves every magician to remove it as much as he can.
Again, I reiterate that the '"defensive resentment" is often manifested
subconsiously and is not shown openly. However, it is still there and must
be removed as best as you are able. Each magician must use his own ingenuity
to do this but do it he MUST.
Contrast this attitude to the magician who bulldozes in and tries to show
how clever he is. His superior attitude will not get results no matter how
good he is. He won't have swept up before he started the show. Or during it.
By "swept up" I mean cleared away all that resentment. In fact I doubt he
even thought of it. And with all due respect I think virtually every close
up magician I have ever seen does not seem to have considered this very
important factor in any way whatever.
I consider it all the time when I am working. I am constantly trying to
disarm everyone from the enthusiastic spectator to the heckler.
How do you do it? It is not for everyone to act absent minded and
incompetent like I do. However, there is always a way. If you are
handicapped in some way for example, you will automatically remove a great
deal of this resentment. If you are funny, this will help too although you
must take care not to dilute the magic. If you are modest or humble this
will help. If you have charm this will also help.
There is utterly no rule as to how you choose to remove this "defensive
resentment"
However remove it you must.
By doing this for the last 40 years I have been able to garner amazingly
good reactions. I do not believe for one moment that I would have achieved
these results if I had not paid due attention to this basic fact of audience
psychology.
Yet it is virtually never mentioned in any book.
Take their guns away. Your audience response will DOUBLE.
It has for me anyway.
..................................................................If this and the previous post is read carefully you will see that it is perfectly possible to discourage hecklers from bothering you in the first place. It is not foolproof and indeed a few hecklers will get through. But that is good for you as I have already stated. It keeps you on your toes and is a very good thing indeed.
Remember though. TAKE THEIR GUNS AWAY and they won't want to heckle you in the first place.
Edited by Mark.Lewis (11/17/09 02:44 PM)
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#208326 - 11/17/09 02:50 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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David Scollnik
Registered: 01/19/08
Posts: 87
Loc: Calgary
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Mark, 30 or 40 years ago, did you ever perform as the magician at the annual Xmas party for children of the employees of Canada Packers? I believe it was usually held in the Royal Canadian Legion building near Islington subway station (in Toronto).
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#208330 - 11/17/09 03:21 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: David Scollnik]
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Kent Gunn
Registered: 05/15/08
Posts: 208
Loc: Bay Area, California
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Mr. Lewis,
One does have to sort a bit through your posturing and twaddle. I only bother for the occasional gem like the one two posts above.
Your insight is astonishly clear. The lucidity, with which, you communicate, when not being mean-spirited or just silly has made all the sifting worthwhile.
Thank you,
Kent Gunn
Redwood City, California
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#208352 - 11/17/09 04:23 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Kent Gunn]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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Kent. If I didn't make you work a little to get the insight you wouldn't appreciate it. Just giving the info away free is not enough. If you get something for nothing you put a nothing value on it. By making you work by sifting the wheat from the chaff it benefits you more
As to David Scollnik's post I was about to say that it was impossible because I only emigrated to Canada in 1992. But on reflection I forgot that I DID come here often around 30 to 35 years ago and it was indeed mainly at Christmas. Some agents did give me various gigs in Toronto during that period. It is therefore quite possible that I did the show in question. I cannot say for sure though since it was so long ago.
My appearance was different then. If you were at that actual show then go by my voice which is heard on various clips on the internet. It is a distinctive voice and may give you a clue.
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#208381 - 11/17/09 10:31 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Pete McCabe
Registered: 01/18/08
Posts: 1368
Loc: Woodland Hills
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Mark,
Thanks for reposting two insightful selections. I'm with Kent; it's very refreshing to have just your thoughts without all the rest of the chaff, as you put it.
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#208383 - 11/17/09 10:45 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Pete McCabe]
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James Munton
Registered: 05/30/08
Posts: 95
Loc: Dallas, TX
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People always want something for nothing, don't they Mark? Which reminds me, when are you going to send me your psychic course?
I'm glad you've stopped talking about the Choo Choo Train Wreck and sucker tricks. Now you really are giving away the good stuff! I agree with all of it (and not just because Richard told me to)!
Best,
James
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#208391 - 11/17/09 11:10 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: James Munton]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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That makes a bloody change.
And you will get my very expensive psychic course when you send me your very expensivce marketing course which doesn't exist yet.
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#208466 - Yesterday at 08:12 AM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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Now. Are there any more questions? When you have an oracle of wisdom among you advantage should be taken of it.
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#208614 - Today at 03:55 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Mark.Lewis]
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Glenn Bishop
Registered: 03/14/08
Posts: 417
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I have a question but it is going to take me a while to ask it. Mark after watching you entertain kids in a video you remind me a little bit of Heba Habba Al. Who was one of the great Chicago Bar Magicians and close up magicians.
So that leads me into my question. Mark I know that you are also a great close up magician with loads of bar - pub experience.
In a way it is a question about handeling drunks and hard drinking audiences.
So my question is in to parts - do you have selection of magic that you do for a hard drinking audience - close up. And how do you use it to entertain and win over the harder drinking audience?
Thanks in advance.
_________________________
Bish The Magish
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#208618 - Today at 04:45 PM
Re: I am bored stiff!
[Re: Glenn Bishop]
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Mark.Lewis
Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 439
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I am slightly horrifed to hear that I am a bit like Heba Habba Al. I know he had a great reputation even though I never saw him work. However he doesn't sound like the kind of perfomer I would have much in common with. I heard that he could be quite blue and also insulting. I am very prudish and don't approve of blue humour and I don't like insult humour either. Except on the Genii Forum of course. And I am taken aback to hear you say that what I did in a children's show reminds you of him. A kid show? Al didn't do kid shows did he?
I have never been a bar magician and any performing I have done in pubs or bars have been impromptu audiences for my friends and anyone else who happens to come over.
I am not terribly prone to working to drunks and in fact earlier on this thread I advised against doing so if you have the option.
Of course it depends on how drunk they are. A little drunk is fine. Medium drunk maybe fine. Very drunk is not fine. For the first two groups you should use something visual and easily followed. For the last group you should make yourself scarce unless you have no choice.
Despite the lamentations of James Munton sucker tricks work quite well for drunks providing they aren't too complicated. They won't be much good if the people in question are too inebriated though. My basic advice is to avoid very drunk people as much as possible.
Close up is one thing. Stand up work is another. I have had an unbelieveable amount of hassle from working to drunks for months on end in London night clubs. Very difficult indeed and to make things worse I was not a seasoned act. When I was young I had more energy to hustle than I have now so managed to work some of the top night clubs in London with a lousy act. And to drunks. Not one or two persons drunk in the audience but ALL of them. The horrifying details are in my memoirs that I expect to be published fairly soon.
Basically my philosophy on this is very similar to the philosophy espoused by Ormond Mc'Gill with regard to hypnosis shows. That is that a little drink helps whereas too much hinders.
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